Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:39 am Post subject:
Finally Learning FinalSun, Help Appreciated!
[ This thread used to be callled "SP Map Crashes During Loading" but at this point it's more of a "I'm new to FinalSun" thread, so just a heads-up! ]
So it took me 25 years to get into TS mapping. And everything seems okay except that this one particular map I've started in SP mode won't load. I get the internal error crash upon loading it, so I can't test it. I've just added a new house and set it to be player controlled.
What are some usual causes for this crash? The map currently just has terrain and a single infantry unit. Any ideas? Bonus points if anyone manages to tell me why Final Sun likes to reset my toolbar spacing and some options like which is the player house. Randomly. Another question would be what does LAT stand for? I'm aware of the function though.
Using FinalSun from TSinstaller3-beta11r6 by Tore. Last edited by AZ-Stalker on Sun Dec 10, 2017 4:04 pm; edited 1 time in total QUICK_EDIT
By default, finalsun adds like Player=GDI House under [Basic] section in
the map. It needs correction by removing the space and House. It should
be only like Player=GDI.
Can't do anything about the toolbar, finalsun is old.
If you are starting now, it is recommended to use TS Client which has got
bug fixes to both TS and finalsun. Download and update it to latest version:
https://ppmforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=40462 QUICK_EDIT
Could you elaborate on how I would go about fixing the [Basic] section? That's one thing I'm new at. I've loaded in some custom light post edits via INI, but that's about it. I've also just noticed that the map seems to be switching itself to Multiplayer Only value 1 for some reason, odd bits like that seem to happen every time I reload FinalSun. Also thank you for the TS client suggestion! Much appreciated! QUICK_EDIT
I swapped out my current game build for the TS Client you suggested. and so far there is no option to pull up custom maps or any folder besides Default and Fanmade within a game lobby, and even when I actually put my .mpr into a folder that IS available, it doesn't show up. Another issue is that FinalSun doesn't recognize any of my maps, which are .mpr, and insists on .map - I see no option to force it to load my files.
For SP maps, you should use .map extension and make entry in battle.ini
in INI folder. Mention the relative path for the map filename in the INI.
For MP maps, those can be dropped in the custom folder in the Maps folder.
If any .map file exists in that folder, TS Client will show the Custom dropdown.
So far things have gone smoothly. Your help is very much appreciated. One thing I've run into just now is that the Ammo Crates neutral building object isn't showing up on my cursor anymore, so I can't place any. Any ideas?
EDIT: Looks like I can mouse-over the tiles where the ammo crates should be. It detects them. So I am placing the crates, but there's no visible object on the map. I can move them around too. They're invisible. QUICK_EDIT
Looks like you found a bug with the TSClient's finalsun, it is not able to read
from TibSun.mix -> tem.mix. Though it works fine with game.
Temporary fix could be that you extract the tem.mix and rename it to
say ecache10.mix and place it in MIX folder. It should be removed after
mapping is done as there is a snow version too in sno.mix.
Forgot to mention - for SP maps, briefing section should be inserted into
the map file itself.
And take backup of your work if you are planning to update TSClient, as
updates may remove the modification of the original files. QUICK_EDIT
Ah got it! I'll give it a try. Thank you.
Could you suggest any other threads where I can learn more
about making singleplayer maps? What code do I need to insert
for the map to have a briefing section?
I really do appreciate all of your help as I'm almost completely
new at mapping for TS. It's been a long time wish of mine so I
have to start somewhere. QUICK_EDIT
Best source of learning is the already existing mission maps.
You could look at the other maps in Maps\Missions folder for line length
limit and format of [Briefing] section. This was a hack change done in TS
Client which is different from vanilla TS, so thought it is worth mentioning. QUICK_EDIT
On a more unrelated note, I just can't seem to shake these two.
A piece of blackness on every destroyed midsection piece, and
what appears to be a shadow glitch. The bridge is not on the top
layers, but the very first cliff level, 4 I guess?
I am not sure but with the lower bridge section, it might happen when
trying to place one object over another which would raise the height or
make wrong placement.
Using ctrl+F would toggle the framework mode in finalsun, which helps
in placing tiles properly.
Also very useful is pressing D key, shows all map in 2D view showing all cells even behind cliffs. For that bridge try see what height have cells for bridge, cliff and ground under bridge. Also I think if you want to have bridge repairable, there should not be any overlay under the bridge such as tiberium. QUICK_EDIT
Thanks for the tips! I'm using D and Control+F views almost constantly
when editing terrain. Looks like my bridge cells are getting detected as
mismatching levels. Some on 0 and the shadow glitch ones at 4, but I
haven't yet figured out an easy solution to fixing it properly. Learning a
lot though. QUICK_EDIT
When you use D to level the map, it will only affect terrain, so things like high bridge overlays will still visually remain in the air.
The shadow glitch at the bottom-right is indeed caused by the bridge section lying on top of the cliff. You can delete it by using the Erase Overlay tool on the sidebar under Special / Overlay.
I can't recall for sure, but I think the other glitch is in the game itself, a mistake in the original terrain tiles.
You can see at all times the level the cursor is on by looking at the bottom-right corner of the map editor, the number after the coordinates. _________________ QUICK_EDIT
All of your input has been very helpful so far. Here's a round of questions I need answers to:
1. Any tutorial for setting up briefings or more on how to edit the .map file with things I need?
2. Regular light post keeps triggering "Our ally is under attack". Doesn't matter which side it's on.
3. What do I need to set up in order to use custom voice clips to play on map triggers?
4. My new house's loading screen, purchase terminal and voice is using Nod's theme / CABAL. How can I change it to be GDI / EVA?
5. Just now, for no apparent reason whatsoever, every time I destroy this ONE SPECIFIC SAM site
on my SP map, I get a Dawn of the Tiberium Age has crashed error. It happens every single time
that SAM reaches 0 HP. Another SAM hooked up to the exact same tag executes its trigger
without any issues. Here's the top part of the error log:
Quote:
Error code: EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION
Description: The thread tried to read from or write to a virtual
address for which it does not have the appropriate access.
Access address:00000064 was written to.
Exception occurred at 005BF525
Version 2.03
Internal Version 2.0
Release Build: 10 by STEVE_TALL - 06/05/2000 - 14:27:06
CPU 686, MMX Yes, Vendor: GenuineIntel
2. Regular light post keeps triggering "Our ally is under attack". Doesn't matter which side it's on.
House as Neutral and Side Civilian should not trigger this ally trigger (only in Spectator mode I have encoutered). Not sure what could trigger it.
AZ-Stalker wrote:
3. What do I need to set up in order to use custom voice clips to play on map triggers?
New sounds in aud format can be added in ECacheXX.mix file and needs to be set in sounds01.ini file. After that it can be used in map. There are tutorials here on PPM about sounds and using sounds in maps with correct offset.
AZ-Stalker wrote:
4. My new house's loading screen, purchase terminal and voice is using Nod's theme / CABAL. How can I change it to be GDI / EVA?
I would suggest to open one of Firestorm campaign maps where GDI uses Cabal AI and vice versa, and see how it was done. QUICK_EDIT
1. Maps are text files, so it can be edited in text editors like Notepad++, Akelpad
freewares or any commersial ones. Look at the other original maps in the Missions
folder and open in the text editor. Search for [Briefing]. Copy paste that section
into your map and modify keeping the format.
2. Check the Allies= for the Player controlled house. If lamps are of Neutral, then
don't put those as allies.
3. Custom voices have to be converted to .aud format. Can do that with XCC Mixer
from wave files. Then you have to make ecacheXX.mix files with those audio files
and put it in MIX folder. XX is unused number between 02 to 99. Register those
file names in sound01.ini - append to the existing list. Look at action 19, sound
number is from sound01.ini to use it in maps.
https://www.modenc.renegadeprojects.com/Actions_(maps)/TSFS
4. Try SpeechSide= under [Basic]. QUICK_EDIT
Hmm, I don't see a Civilian option under the Side drop down. I just got
Neutral and Special, along with various Extras. Neutral is set to side Neutral
and I've had to make additional sides to avoid the enemy AI from destroying
even the neutrals.
How do I set up side Civilian? Also, what is a "side" in those options?
EDIT: Posted after first reply, reading yours now E1. QUICK_EDIT
So a quick update... I changed the Neutral's faction in-editor
House side to be "Civilian" and did the same in the .map as it
didn't appear to change... and now, even after I've renamed it
back ti neutral on all fronts, my map just closes the to-be loading
window without an error. It won't load at all, and I'm not sure
how to fix something I've already reverted. QUICK_EDIT
If my neutral house is called Neutral, an it has its side set as
Civilian, what exactly do I need to replace? Every structure and
unit has itself set to Neutral. Sorry I'm a bit confused. QUICK_EDIT
I'm still testing, but reinstalling the client seems to have fixed my
map-not-starting issue. Stuck game.exe in the background or
something like that. Not sure what to think, honestly.
Hmm... I'm still getting the "Ally under attack" message every
time I hit a neutral light post. What else can I check to try and
remedy this? It's already on Civilian. The notification doesn't
seem to play for attacking any other neutral structure. QUICK_EDIT
I need to have the basic white light post not targetable, hence
why I have it as allied. I also need the enemy team allied with it
since they seem to destroy any neutral thing on sight. It's still
playing the message. Odd that it doesn't trigger on anything else
but the lamp post. All I've done is injected code to edit the light
emission values.
Say, I'm 95% done with my first SP mission, triggers and all,
and now I need a good way to send the mission to someone.
I'm assuming that they need the same TS client for it to work?
Another thing I don't yet know how to do is pack it all up into
a send-able and easily integrate-able package. As it is, the
map only works from my client side modifications, as it uses
battles.ini to list it as a campaign, tutorials.ini for certain text
triggers I've added, and sounds01.ini for SFX.
How do I pack that up without overwriting another person's
client files? Again, I'm completely new at this, so any help
is always greatly appreciated.
Bonus question, how do I integrate other TS speech and voice files?
That can't be the complete set in sounds01.ini... At a glance it looks
as if there's a lot missing. QUICK_EDIT
If you have already modified the light post for light values, could modify
it further and try these, unless you want these destroyed for some purpose:
[GALITE]
LegalTarget=no
Insignificant=yes
Also make Neutral as allied to all enemies but not for the player controlled
house.
Keep the same file/folder structure, map, ini, mix files and zip it and share.
To test your mission, people have to overwrite the modified files, but anyone
can have as many copies of TSClient as they want. They could do that in a
separate copy. I have several copies, without movies.
As for sound01.ini, I think those present in original game should be there.
If some are missing, you could add those. Only the list matters, their
individual section could be skipped, those are used to re-adjust priority
and volume. QUICK_EDIT
Haven't tested that yet, but I will let you know what happens.
Another question: Is there a way to make my triggered TS soundtrack start
before the briefing text pops up. There's always a random track playing
during the briefing and it sometimes misses the mark on the atmosphere
I want conveyed. I'd like to standardize a track for it if possible. QUICK_EDIT
There is an option under [Basic] where a theme could be specified for a
mission with Theme= which takes entry from the list in theme.ini/theme01.ini.
I haven't tested these for a long time, so test it yourself. QUICK_EDIT
So just today I was making a player controlled base as damaged from the
start, and the moment I get some credits the game automatically puts repair
symbols on ALL of them. I'm not in charge of my credits. And it keeps doing
that until everything is repaired. Why does this happen?
Also I'm missing the orange light post visual. It's there, just invisible. Another
bug that I need to temp cache perhaps? QUICK_EDIT
INORNGLAMP from FS has more strength compared to INORANLAMP of
TS. The TS one would have been in the already existing maps, so they
would have added the 2nd one for FS maps. My guess.
I never sold a sandbag till now, if it sells then it would be a first for me!
Though the player becomes the owner of the walls nearby. QUICK_EDIT
I don't see the FS version of the lamp in the editor object lists.
Hmm, the InvisibleInGame option didn't seem to work. The lamp
is still invisible. And categorized wrong since it doesn't say that
it is invisible as I already mentioned. Strange.
Any idea why it's still invisible for in game? I added the line just
below that light's values.
Okay new issue. Upgraded GDI power plants are always at full
health on start. Even though I slid their strenght down a bunch.
Same goes for component towers.
EDIT: I've also got a FONA10 terrain object that can't be deleted. Just one.
Moving tiles up and down does nothing, it stays on the white background.
Deleting as object or overlay doesn't remove it. QUICK_EDIT
My mistake, looks like that property cannot be changed in maps. Other way
is to change the light of some other lamp post that is visible to your required
color. Or you could make a new lamp post in the map itself and replace the
invisible lamp posts with the new one like
[BuildingTypes]
1=ORANLAMP
[ORANLAMP]
Name=Orange Light Post Mod
Image=GALITE
InvisibleInGame=no
.... copy other fields from rules.ini
Only problem here is that finalsun is not able to fetch the GALITE graphics,
instead it shows power plant graphics. Though it will work in game correctly.
Editing rules.ini is much simpler but, you will have package that also with the
map for distribution.
The FS invisible orange lamp is nearly at the end of the list in finalsun.
---------------------------
Upgrade buildings are shown like that by the game.
---------------------------
If the fona is somehow become inaccessible, you could search it in the map
and delete that line like 148135=FONA10. QUICK_EDIT
You have been an invaluable help in my learning experience, just wanted
to let you know! I'll get to implementing your suggestions and we'll see
how it goes. Thank you for answering all of my questions so fast! QUICK_EDIT
If you make changes to rules.ini, those become global and affect all maps,
both SP and MP. Then it becomes a mod. Already your map has altered
some stuff but it still remains local to that map.
Most of the sections from rules.ini/firestrm.ini can be modified in maps. But
you can't do that with what is in art(fs).ini. Modify the fields under relevant
sections, some fields are necessary and some work by default. A wrong entry
may not work or might crash the map. Try these:
Code:
; It is primarily a Nod infantry
[E3]
Prerequisite=BARRACKS
Owner=GDI,Nod
;Doesn't have its own icon in art.ini
[MUTANT]
TechLevel=1
Prerequisite=GAPILE
What would be the best way to implement buildable sandbags and
light towers for the player in a map?
Same question for making the barracks build other units, such as
the rocket trooper or mutant soldier types.
Is it different to implement on a per map basis versus global change?
Simply changing the Prerequisite= for each of the units/infantry/building/aircraft is enough.
You just need to get the Techno's IDs right, and be mindful of generic prequisite-lists (which, simply put, function like a logical OR).
Example: (taken from RA2's Rules. TS is only slightly different)
Code:
[E1] ;GI in RA2, light infantry in TS.
{Stats}
Prerequisite=GAPILE ;GDI/Allied Barracks, depending on the game.
Generic Prerequisites: (Again, RA2 values, and FS has 2 other flags to accommodate for the Mobile War Factories)
Code:
; Building prerequisite categories are specified here.
PrerequisitePower=GAPOWR,NAPOWR,NANRCT;gs NAAPWR
PrerequisiteFactory=GAWEAP,NAWEAP
PrerequisiteBarracks=NAHAND,GAPILE
PrerequisiteRadar=GAAIRC,NARADR,AMRADR
PrerequisiteTech=GATECH,NATECH
PrerequisiteProc=GAREFN,NAREFN
AZ-Stalker wrote:
How do I make crates or cargo truck crate drops give less credits?
It's at 2000 by default.
I'm not sure, but you'll need to c&p the Powerups-section and look for this line:
Code:
[Powerups] ;the 20 may or may not be there.
Money=20,MONEY,yes,2000 ; a chunk o' cash (maximum cash)
See that 2k over there? In-/decrease it.
As for why c&p the whole thing: think of it as a safety measure that the override WILL work.
C&C S testing has confirmed the [Powerups] is very stubborn to changes, and doesn't accept partial overrides like most sections do. You're all welcome to prove me wrong tho.
EDIT: Screw you, Ninja Elite _________________ One and only developer of the Command & Conquer Dune "C&C D" mod.
m7 wrote:
I tend to release things I create so that assets are never lost to hard drive problems, accidental deletion, or me having to pretend to care about rippers taking things from my project when it is done.
What would be the best way to implement buildable sandbags and
light towers for the player in a map?
Or create new building with existing ART, but do not forget to add list too. Also use some letters as index number in list, so it won't interfere with already existing buildings or other TS mods.
For buildable light tower, the spotlight will face always NE direction and will have Sweep light behavior. You can additionally tweak light adding spotlight keys in map too, or have it disabled for buildable tower.
For adding new buildable units such as mutants, I would also suggest creating new ones, so it won't interfere with existing ones. Also vanilla TS does not have cameo icons for mutant art entries as E1 Elite mentioned, so player will see only gray missing cameo icons.
AZ-Stalker wrote:
Is it different to implement on a per map basis versus global change?
For map you can only override or add data, that are int rules.ini (there are some exceptions). But you should be careful with changing stats for regular buildable units, some players could complain about it, such as changing health, weapon, speed for already buildable vehicles, infantry, etc. But for SP map it should not be such issue.
Why thanks for all the info everyone! Will test all of this out soon and most likely come back with even more questions.
So I've noticed random civilians show up on my map, just their
tiles, when they move. They're neutral, but allied. Why are they
revealing themselves? Is it because of them being set to "move"
due to them being allies with the player?
How do I add power to the player without extra power plants?
As in, even if the player looses the two PPs I've set, I still want
there to be power for some things, but no PPs visible on the map.
Here, have a free screenshot of my WIP second mission base
so you know I'm not wasting all this information on ugly MS
Paint level map aesthetics. Doing my best with what I know.
For extra power put some power plants behind map visible area, but you need to add some lose triggers so player could be defeated. I would suggest creating new building for player and placing it behind visible area with power and Insignificant=yes key, so it should be ignored for Lose logic. QUICK_EDIT
EDIT 2 Huh, the PPs should be damaged. Need to fix. Also any tips
on how to avoid the cast light having harsh transitions?
By lowering LightIntensity= and/or increasing LightVisibility=
The screenshot looks realy nice. Not sure if some buildings do not overlap with other buildings and sandbags (waystation near radar and building near rocket infantry) Last edited by Tuc0 on Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:28 pm; edited 2 times in total QUICK_EDIT
You can also play with tweaking LightRedTint, LightBlueTint, LightGreenTint compared to LightIntensity key. Increasing those first 3 keys will illuminate terrain more but not units. With increasing LightIntensity the lightning will also affect illumination of units, not just terrain.
Also there is a bug in TS, that after loading saved game, the light is no longer attached to buildings, so when destroyed/sold, light will remain in map.
It isn't big problem, but should be noted. You can also slightly illuminate area with invisible light posts, or replace with those with Alpha image.
EDIT:
AZ-Stalker wrote:
EDIT 2 Huh, the PPs should be damaged.
It is also bug in TS that giving upgrade to building will instantly heal building, same applies for preplaced buildings in map, so you can not have pre-damaged upgraded buildings. You need to apply additional damage using triggers at start of the map (celltag under building or attached trigger in building properties). Last edited by Tuc0 on Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:45 pm; edited 2 times in total QUICK_EDIT
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Finally Learning FinalSun, Help Appreciated!
